Aimed at devs: harmonics control for horns, trumpets.

Pierce

Hello!



This post is really aimed at the developers, but I'd greatly enjoy reading any responses pertaining to this post.



I own all SM Brass. I love the harmonic control (EDIT: "timbral shaping") for the Trombone3. I was wondering if there were plans to have updates for the horns and the trumpets that have the same control? I really would like to be able to increase and decrease certain partials to simulate different microphone placements.



The horns especially sound incredibly pinched and nasal in the upper 1.5 octave, as though you recorded a low-horn player to do the entire range; it would greatly benefit from decreased mid and high partials, or a boost to the fundamental.



I'm also wondering if overtone tuning would be possible later in the future? The instruments sometime sound pretty flat and I wonder if some inharmonicity could improve their sound. For example, you could raise the 3rd and 4th partials a little bit, widening the 5th and 8ve from the first overtone (second partial), resulting in a pleasing buzz?



I'm curious as to any thoughts you may have on the subject, and hopefully some insight in your upcoming plans for both your products in question.

Peter Siedlaczek

Hi Pierce,



yes, we are already working on the upgrades of The Trumpet and the French Horn, so that they will have similar features like Trombone 3. We cannot, however, say when we will be ready.



As to your suggestion to introduce some inharmonicity, please note that our instruments are not synthesizers; they use original samples of the instruments, hence deep modifications of the sound content - like detuning single harmonics - are not possible. In my opinion, however, it would go far beyond any realism - which of course can be also very exciting, but is not our primary aim. In particular the manipulation of the frequency of the single harmonics would in most of the cases add nasty, harsh components and lead to very dissonant results (at least in brass). This does not apply of course to manipulating the intensity of the harmonics (as it is now in the Trombone 3). By the way, simulating different microphone placements can also be done even now by acting on an (external) equalizer and early reflections, for example.



I personally would not agree with your sentence that the horns sound "extremely pinchy" in a certain range. They do sound like a real french horn sounds, if properly miked 1 - 1,5 meters away, played by professional, skillful players, specialized in playing low and high parts of the score. But I think I know the reason for your judgment... :-)

Please do not forget that we sampled our instruments in an anechoic environment to get the pure "quintessence" of the sound, as it is. I am not sure how often you had a chance to listen to a french horn in a completely dry environment. As we all know the french horn is an instrument which develops his full sound quality only when listened from a longer distance in an ambience - in other words, in a very diffuse field - never dry and close. A relatively closed miked horn (not toward the bell, but toward the body!) does sound the way our horns do - and this is perfectly correct. But if you:

- take care about the proper ambience around them and use more ambience/reverb than direct sound, as it is the case under real conditions,

- simulate some alternative microphone placements acting on an EQ according to your taste, if you prefer so,

you will get wonderful sound which you can also find in the demos. By the way, do you find the sound in our demos, like for example, in the Weber´s Concertino, in the "Lyrical Demo" or "Two Winds" also "incredibly pinched"?.. Still, if you prefer a timbre which is more hollow in the midrange, you can certainly modify it in the right direction applying, additionally, a gentle EQ curve reducing some middle frequencies.

In other words: our virtual horns provide a "complete", or "normal" sound of a dry, relatively closed miked horn which you can modify according to your taste and the needs of your arrangement. The future version will certainly make this task more efficient.



Regards



Peter & Giorgio

MSchnell

Hi Peter.

I do not yet have any swam instrument, but am certainly considering to buy one some day.



Thanks for the thorough explanations !



Are all the tools you speak of (EQ, Ambiance) included in the software instrument or do I need to add external 3rd party tools for that ?



Thanks,

-Michael

Peter Siedlaczek

Hi Michael,



SWAM instruments have a built-in reverb and can load different "instruments" (sounding a bit different, simulating different mic positions, for example). For simulating a distance, an additional/external ambience/early reflections are needed.

Kontakt-based instruments like French horns, and in particular the latest Trombone 3 have very well working early reflection algorithms to control, for example, the distance of the instruments. Trumpets will follow. Furthermore, a high-quality convolution reverb or additional EQs or filters belonging to the Kontakt / Kontakt Player software can be inserted in its output section for further treatment (see Kontakt Manual).



Please do not hesitate to download any of our Manuals available for everybody on the Download pages belonging to the appropriate instruments.



Peter

MSchnell

Thanks lot for the clarification.



Of course a way to try the software (in combination with my WX7 - that I did not touch since some 20 years) would be great.



-Michael